How to pitch food stories to The Good Housekeeping Institute with Stacey Smith, Senior Food and Drink Editor

Alessia Horwich (00:07):

Welcome to On The Rox, a podcast from Roxhill Media that asks some of the best journalists in the UK for their solutions to the kind of dilemmas that confront PRs daily. We know that there’s not a one size fits all way of communicating with journalists, so we’re going direct to the writers in the newsroom to hear how they like to work with PRs and how you can stand out in their inboxes. My name is Alessia Horwich. I’m a former Sunday Times journalist now the director of Creative Content and Brand at Roxhill. Today we’re going to be talking about how to pitch food stories to the Good Housekeeping Institute with its Senior Food and Drink editor Stacey Smith. Stacey, I’ve met you many times,

Stacey Smith (00:48):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (00:48):

but we’ve never really dug into whether you really started out wanting to be a journalist or not. Like what did you imagine yourself being someone who’d be paid to try 96 Easter Eggs every year?

Stacey Smith (00:58):

Who imagines that? Do you know what? It’s really funny. I was thinking about this the other day when I was at school, I loved reading so much. I was like an insatiable reader, but I remember being told off at school for writing in too much like an editorial tone, not essay like. So no, I didn’t. And also I worked in fashion for many years and I was always blogging on the side, before Instagram existed, there were blogs,

Alessia Horwich (01:27):

Yeah

Stacey Smith (01:27):

Feel like a right Dinosaur,

Alessia Horwich (01:29):

I do remember that

Stacey Smith (01:29):

do you remember those days? So I was doing that, so I was always writing about food on the side, and then I actually got made redundant from my buyer job in COVID at the very start of COVID and I thought, you know what? I’m actually going to pursue writing full time. I’d already been doing a lot of freelance stuff on the side for years. And yeah, I’m so thankful for that opportunity, otherwise I’d have never ended up here. And yeah, I really love it. It’s such a fun gig.

Alessia Horwich (01:54):

So you went from being made redundant to into GH

Stacey Smith (01:57):

Basically, yeah, I freelanced for a bit and then into GH. Yeah, they were creating this team and I was really lucky enough to be the first hire and then we set it up and it is now where it is today.

Alessia Horwich (02:07):

Yeah, where is it today?

Stacey Smith (02:08):

Where is it today?

Alessia Horwich (02:09):

This is the thing, it’s quite confusing. When we first spoke it was Hearst. Well, I think it was Good Housekeeping Institute when we first spoke, and then it was Hearst Institute and now it’s Good Housekeeping.

Stacey Smith (02:17):

Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (02:18):

Can you talk a little bit about how it’s evolved and what you guys are doing now and what you’re focusing on?

Stacey Smith (02:22):

Of course. Yes. So Good Housekeeping and the Institute has been going about a hundred years, right? So it’s

Alessia Horwich (02:28):

I mean is it literally a hundred years

Stacey Smith (02:28):

yeah

Alessia Horwich (02:28):

or is it

Stacey Smith (02:29):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (02:29):

Gosh.

Stacey Smith (02:30):

Literally. Yeah. So really impressive, massive Heritage brands, but probably about five years ago now, there was the decision to rebrand it as the Hearst Institute, and the idea was that we would then service all 14 of our titles, not just Good Housekeeping. We were doing all of this amazing work and the amount of work that goes into each test, we thought we could roll this out and make it.

Alessia Horwich (02:50):

Can you explain it a bit? Because I’m not sure everybody really understands

Stacey Smith (02:52):

all of the work.

Alessia Horwich (02:53):

Yeah

Stacey Smith (02:53):

Yes. Okay. So basically we have a massive testing facility in Felton in West London and each vertical, so food and drink, beauty, health, wellness, tech, goes on and on and on. Everything’s tested there. So if it’s Easter Eggs, for example, we have a whole team there. They call in the samples, everything gets blinded, so you don’t have any brand bias to any particular product and you are asked to try something, feedback, the team then collate all of that feedback, score it, pass it on to me, and then I write it up

Alessia Horwich (03:25):

Right

Stacey Smith (03:25):

and then it goes into either print or digital or both. Anyway. And then basically we’ve just gone back to the original,

Alessia Horwich (03:32):

Why have you gone back to the original?

Stacey Smith (03:33):

They like to call Good Housekeeping, the jewel in the Crown. So it’s by far the biggest brand at Hearst by miles, by every metric. So page views, revenue, everything. So it made more sense for us to focus the team’s efforts. We can only write so many pieces of content a month, obviously. So it made more sense to focus it there rather than spread ourselves too thinly. I think.

Alessia Horwich (03:56):

That’s really interesting because I don’t think you would necessarily think it’s the sexiest

Stacey Smith (04:01):

How dare you

Alessia Horwich (04:02):

Magazine in the Hearst.

Stacey Smith (04:03):

Well, it’s really interesting you say that actually. I think it’s definitely getting a bit sexier.

Alessia Horwich (04:07):

Is it

Stacey Smith (04:08):

Ms. Jane Bruton is our new editor in chief. She came on board this year. Her job is to rebrand GH, basically

Alessia Horwich (04:16):

What’s Jane’s background?

Stacey Smith (04:17):

She launched Grazia in the uk, so you remember Grazia those days. That was a good day.

Alessia Horwich (04:24):

I loved Grazia when it first came out.

Stacey Smith (04:25):

Yeah it was a great

Alessia Horwich (04:25):

Loved it

Stacey Smith (04:25):

magazine. Exactly. And so I think she’s got really fun energy and it’s definitely, it is a hard job, like I say, a hundred years old. So we’re trying to rebrand and attract new readers while also keeping our core reader engaged as well. So I think her first design, her redesign was the April issue. So it’s still super, super early days, but actually feedback has been so positive and one of the questions I think they asked was, would you be proud to be seen reading GH? And I think that’s improved by quite a considerable amount. I don’t have the exact percentage, but we are definitely going in the right direction.

Alessia Horwich (05:04):

How’s that make you feel personally?

Stacey Smith (05:05):

Yeah, I do feel more proud to be, because I’m not going to lie, I loved working on Esquire, loved working on Harper’s and ELLE because they’re seen as a bit sexier right? And we could put maybe slightly higher price point products in there and that was lovely. But actually it feels good to be in such a well established brand and moving in the right direction and being part of that journey at such an exciting time in its history. I think we will look back on this period and have things to say about it. I feel like there should be a little film crew following us around the office at the moment. I think it’s that,

Alessia Horwich (05:36):

not in the comedy way.

Stacey Smith (05:38):

maybe slightly in the comedy way, some of the planning sessions are quite hilarious.

Alessia Horwich (05:42):

I’d like to be a fly on the wall.

Stacey Smith (05:44):

Oh yeah

Alessia Horwich (05:44):

When you are doing it like a sampling, I mean these Easter eggs,

Stacey Smith (05:47):

96 of them

Alessia Horwich (05:47):

How 90 does it work? Is it crazy? I mean, how many people are involved in doing that and how much of it do you actually eat?

Stacey Smith (05:54):

It is quite crazy. It’s a bit Willy Wonka esque at times. There’s a whole team looking after it, so they’re really dedicated and very, very organised. But yeah, you’ll be presented with, I think they probably do it in batches of about 10. So you don’t get pallet fatigue there or thereabouts and 10 people will be there and yeah, you dunno what you’re testing, you dunno what brand it’s from. You try the smallest amount. Obviously you do feel a bit sick afterwards.

Alessia Horwich (06:18):

Yeah. What’s the best thing you’ve ever sampled?

Stacey Smith (06:20):

Ever, ever?

Alessia Horwich (06:21):

Yeah.

Stacey Smith (06:23):

I mean that would be like choosing a child,

Alessia Horwich (06:24):

Is there anything

Stacey Smith (06:24):

My youngest one. No I’m only joking,

Alessia Horwich (06:29):

but is there anything that sticks out in your mind? I mean from being a travel journalist, I can remember the best place I’ve ever stayed.

Stacey Smith (06:35):

Oh yeah, it’s such a perk of the job, isn’t it? We are so lucky. I’ve been flown to Panama to try rum. That was pretty nice. It probably tasted better because I was there. I’m not going to lie.

Alessia Horwich (06:47):

Yeah.

Stacey Smith (06:47):

I dunno. Just, yeah, and really, really rare whiskeys or being one of the first in the world to try something is such an honour, isn’t it?

Alessia Horwich (06:56):
It’s quite an astonishing experience.

Stacey Smith (06:57):

Oh, it’s so wonderful. I never stopped feeling properly grateful for the role.

Alessia Horwich (07:02):

Have you always been a confirmed foodie?

Stacey Smith (07:05):

I really have, to be honest. Yeah. My granddad was a Smithfield Butcher. My nan was a baker, so food was at the heart of the family always. And I’ve just always loved it. I remember just always making lists of restaurants I wanted to visit and from such an early age. So yeah, I’ve just always loved it. I still really do love it. It’s always changing. There’s always new trends, there’s always new things to discover and I love the stories behind some of the smaller brands. I love hearing about why it’s been created. Food is such a labour of love, isn’t it? You don’t get into it unless you love it, I don’t think.

Alessia Horwich (07:36):

I guess one of the things that might be tricky for PRs to navigate for the GH Institute is what is the border between cookery and what you’re doing?

Stacey Smith (07:46):

Yeah, we are quite distinct, which is quite good, I suppose. So really I’m an e-comm role, so everything we do has to make money. The cookery team are known for having triple tested recipes, so they spend all day creating recipes. We really don’t cross over at all.

Alessia Horwich (08:01):

So they’re recipes. But I mean, if you have a branded ingredient and you’re wanting a Good Housekeeping recipe, does that happen? Or if it’s a product, it’s you.

Stacey Smith (08:10):

If it’s a product, it’s me. I don’t know if they particularly use branded. Well,

Alessia Horwich (08:17):

Is that an e-commerce thing?

Stacey Smith (08:18):

Yeah, it’s more an e-commerce thing. It kind of sits with me, I’d say,

Alessia Horwich (08:22):

right

Stacey Smith (08:22):

come to me with that sort of thing yeah and we can make sure it goes in the right place.

Alessia Horwich (08:26):

Tell me about e-commerce and affiliates and how that works and why it’s such an important thing for Hearst.

Stacey Smith (08:32):

Yeah, it’s a beast. So when we look at doing a new piece, we look at a few things. So search obviously has to be there, but also we look at the revenue opportunities. So we only feature affiliate stockists, so that’s important. And then the other opportunity for us is a brand. If they’re eligible to purchase the logo, if they pass our test, they’re eligible to purchase the logo and then yeah, that’s another revenue stream for us.

Alessia Horwich (08:56):

So those are the two ways that you make money

Stacey Smith (08:58):

Yeah pretty much. And then there is also opportunity with this new kitchen that’s being fitted. We’re calling it I think like the GH pantry or something, but there’s an opportunity to be a branded partner within that. So when the cookery team are making their recipes, it might be branded salt that they’re using or branded herbs and spices or wine pairings, whatever. The opportunities are pretty endless at Hearst.

Alessia Horwich (09:24):

That’s interesting though,

Stacey Smith (09:26):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (09:26):

Which I think is kind of challenging from a PR perspective because where’s the line between a paid partnership and editorial? So how do you go about commissioning the stuff that you’re doing? I mean, you said you’d look at search terms and stuff, I’m assuming it’s seasonality, but where’d you get your ideas from?

Stacey Smith (09:40):

Yeah, that’s a good question. So some ideas are, will come through, I don’t know, just going to a restaurant review and really noticing a trend that everyone’s using consistently or Instagram. There’s so many viral trends now that just, Dubai chocolate is still so popular on the site.

Alessia Horwich (10:00):

Is it?

Stacey Smith (10:00):

They cannot get enough of it.

Alessia Horwich (10:01):

We had some of it in the office actually.

Stacey Smith (10:03):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (10:03):

Someone bought, yeah.

Stacey Smith (10:03):

People are obsessed. So yeah, all of those things, and a lot of it is just driven by seasonality. And also we go to a lot of trade shows and you know a lot of the supermarkets show do a seasonal tasting, seasonal show, and so we’ll pick up some ideas there.

Alessia Horwich (10:19):

Yeah,

Stacey Smith (10:19):

yeah.

Alessia Horwich (10:19):

For PRs, I assume they need to be doing all of those things that you’re doing, but I mean, are you looking to them as well to feed into your ideas?

Stacey Smith (10:27):

Yeah, definitely. And it’s really interesting when a PR gets in touch and says, oh, we’ve seen an increase in search for this product because it kind of indicates that actually maybe that is something we should be covering or doing or looking at. So yeah.

Alessia Horwich (10:40):

Yeah. How much content are you guys having to produce?

Stacey Smith (10:43):

The target is about 30 pieces a month per person, which might not sound like a lot, but

Alessia Horwich (10:48):

it does sound like a lot to me.

Stacey Smith (10:49):

Okay, good.

Alessia Horwich (10:50):

A lot. A lot.

Stacey Smith (10:50):

It is quite a lot

Alessia Horwich (10:51):

And per person. How many people are on your team?

Stacey Smith (10:54):

On my direct team, there’s about eight of us looking after each article.

Alessia Horwich (10:58):

But you’re the only person doing food?

Stacey Smith (11:00):

Yes.

Alessia Horwich (11:00):
What are the different formats of article you do?

Stacey Smith (11:03):

So we’re not really limited. We do do a lot of best roundups, but we’re always looking at different ways to do it. So I think that really suits food and drink. But on the wellness, for example, they might do, “I’m a wellness editor and I’ve tried this”. Everything’s tried and tested, so it’s really, that’s our USP. So I think it’s the important thing is getting that across just how rigorous the testing is because obviously a lot of people are now doing a similar thing. But yeah, I really believe in the way we do it.

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Alessia Horwich (12:39):

If you’re going to be trying and testing everything, you’ve got to get the stuff.

Stacey Smith (12:42):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (12:42):

How does sampling work and how can PRs get involved with that. And does it all? I guess it all goes to the Institute in the end. Yeah.

Stacey Smith (12:50):

Yeah, so it’s best to get in touch before sending anything. Callum and my team at Feltham, they organise all the tests so they try and group like for like products together. If we’re doing Easter eggs, it’ll be at one time, there’ll be one day. So the logistics of it are quite important, I would say.

Alessia Horwich (13:08):

Yeah.

Stacey Smith (13:08):

So yeah, I wouldn’t just send things without checking because we need to make sure that there’s a relevant test coming up to place it in, if you know what I mean.

Alessia Horwich (13:16):

Yeah, I mean, other than say Easter eggs, what are the other big things through the year that you’re always going to do?

Stacey Smith (13:24):

So our biggest event of the year, which I cannot believe I’m saying this, but we’ve already sent out the email, is Christmas. It’s just huge. It’s a beast. I think we are now up to about 40 different tests. So yeah, everything from obviously Turkey, but there’s Christmas brunch and all the booze

Alessia Horwich (13:44):

Christmas brunch?

Stacey Smith (13:44):

Yeah, I know. Well that’s a trend

Alessia Horwich (13:46):

A trend yeah.

Stacey Smith (13:46):

That came out of the shows. We were seeing people a tree shaped crumpet for example. Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (13:57):

The shows though, you’re saying these came out of the shows, the Christmas in July, isn’t it? Or is it before now, July?

Stacey Smith (14:02):

Yes, we looked at last year.

Alessia Horwich (14:02):

Last year’s shows ok

Stacey Smith (14:03):

what’s bubbling up, little bits and pieces and then we try and apply it for this year.

Alessia Horwich (14:08):

Wow,

Stacey Smith (14:09):

know, I love it.

Alessia Horwich (14:10):

I mean, I’m genuinely astonished that

Stacey Smith (14:12):

I know

Alessia Horwich (14:12):

you’ve got stuff from the shows last year that you are now going to be writing about.

Stacey Smith (14:16):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (14:16):

I mean, that’s so far in advance lead times wise. This must be really bamboozling for PRs.

Stacey Smith (14:21):

Yes

Alessia Horwich (14:21):

What’s the ideal lead time?

Stacey Smith (14:23):

Christmas is unique in the fact that we are already looking at it now in May, and we go live with that on the site in mid-October, but that’s by far the longest.

Alessia Horwich (14:32):

And is it then done in mid-October or

Stacey Smith (14:35):

Well, yeah.

Alessia Horwich (14:35):

Does it continue online?

Stacey Smith (14:37):

That’s when we launch it, but then we will keep updating it with, we can’t test anything after that, but I’ll update it with, I don’t know, more seasonal references or we’ll look after those URLs and make sure they’re optimised for search throughout the year.

Alessia Horwich (14:51):

I’m thinking about other things though as well. So Easter eggs, is there anything else that will come up again and again that the PRs can understand

Stacey Smith (14:58):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (14:58):

That you will

Stacey Smith (15:00):

To be honest, the best thing to do is probably search my byline in GH because you’ll just see everything we’ve ever written and we do update a lot of them. A lot of the things are quite evergreen as well. So like champagne, well all booze basically is evergreen. So brandy is doing really well for us this year randomly. I know it’s quite strange. So yeah, we’ll just keep updating that and making sure that’s looked after. Recipe kits for example. That was just a round year round thing that we always look after. But otherwise, the big seasonal things, picky tea, Easter barbecue, Christmas, kind of the big ones for us.

Alessia Horwich (15:34):

And how does it work for updating those evergreen articles? Do you guys?

Stacey Smith (15:38):

Yeah, so basically if someone gets in touch and says, I’ve got this new product and I think it’s worth testing, then we would call that in and update the article.

Alessia Horwich (15:48):

How would you judge if it’s worth testing?

Stacey Smith (15:49):

I dunno, I guess if it just sounds like a GH product, something that the GH customer would want to buy.

Alessia Horwich (15:57):

Tell me more about the GH customer.

Stacey Smith (15:58):

I guess, who is it? I think it’s quite, well we’ve been told, we’ve done our research and apparently she is multi generational. So she might not be as old as you think. She’s getting sexier as we’ve discussed, but yeah, something that’s relevant, interesting, might have some nice branding, might have a nice backstory, might be the right price point, just a good fit for the piece.

Alessia Horwich (16:22):

Is she bougie, is she sort of boutiquey or is she less so and how much money does she have?

Stacey Smith (16:28):

I think she’s probably got more money than you think. Maybe not Esquire levels, but she’s doing all right for herself. It really, really depends on the product. I think I probably wouldn’t be putting in a 500 pound bottle of whiskey, but there’s certain products you can push more than others.

Alessia Horwich (16:46):

Like?

Stacey Smith (16:46):

I mean, Brandy, we’ve got some quite expensive bottles in and I am really surprised to see how they’re doing,

Alessia Horwich (16:52):

How much is quite expensive?

Stacey Smith (16:54):

Maybe a hundred quid.

Alessia Horwich (16:55):

Oh yeah. But it still goes.

Stacey Smith (16:56):

Yeah,

Alessia Horwich (16:57):

And you can track all the sales.

Stacey Smith (16:58):

Oh my god, I love, I’m such a spreadsheet nerd.

Alessia Horwich (17:01):

Are you?

Stacey Smith (17:01):

I love it. I love all the data. I think I used to work in buying, I’m really driven by revenue. Just seeing those numbers go up is just such a thrill. It makes you know that you’re on the right track, you’re doing the right work.

Alessia Horwich (17:16):

I think that’s really interesting because lots of journalists would be like, ugh commerce,

Stacey Smith (17:19):

I know.

Alessia Horwich (17:19):

No thanks, I don’t want to think about that.

Stacey Smith (17:21):

I think it’s actually probably not very sexy, not seen as a very sexy job, but I honestly love it. I just think having those two factors, you can still be really creative. The writing is still really high level, really good standard. The subbing we go through is really meticulous, but then you have the way the e-comm as well. I love it.

Alessia Horwich (17:39):

Yeah. When someone’s pitching a product to you, I mean we’ve spoken to some other journalists, they’ve sort of said that a really good way of getting yourself maybe over the line or towards line is including details that are really going to make your copy sing. Is that something that’s for you as well?

Stacey Smith (17:56):

Yeah, definitely. I mean, anything that makes my life easier. I think we have such little time like everyone and we get so many emails, so anything that just stands out, I do read every single email I get and I file everything, but anything that just stands out is going to be really useful to me. You would be so surprised the amount of times people get in touch and say blah, blah, blah product. Would you like to, they don’t even tell me what it is and if it’s not a well-known brand, I honestly wouldn’t know if it was a bottle of gin or a packet of nappies. Just you need to tell me what it is and include a link. But yeah, anything, any nice backstory. It doesn’t have to be long. Just a little snippet of why it’s interesting

Alessia Horwich (18:36):

Yeah

Stacey Smith (18:36):

is really useful because like I say, how do I know to call it in? Why am I calling it in? Why is it different to the other 15 bottles of gin in the roundup? Why should this be in it?

Alessia Horwich (18:46):

What’s the point of difference?

Stacey Smith (18:47):

What’s the point of difference? Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (18:48):

Yeah,and maybe people forget about doing that because of the e-commerce slant to it and it’s more like, but you have to remember actually this is something people are going to read

Stacey Smith (18:56):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (18:56):

it has to be interesting as well.

Stacey Smith (18:57):

Definitely.

Alessia Horwich (18:58):

And persuasive, I guess.

Stacey Smith (18:59):

Definitely. Yeah, for sure.

Alessia Horwich (19:01):

Yeah. Are there any hacks that PRs can use to know which one of your articles are more updateable i.e more popular?

Stacey Smith (19:10):

I guess just look at the timestamp. If it’s a recent timestamp, then you’ll see that we’ve been updating it recently

Alessia Horwich (19:16):

And you might want to update it again.

Stacey Smith (19:18):

Yeah,

Alessia Horwich (19:18):

okay. Can they be looking at search terms and thinking.

Stacey Smith (19:20):

Yeah, for sure. Yeah, definitely. I’d love that. It makes my life easier. Obviously we do that a lot as well on a daily basis. The SEO team tells us what’s trending and that will drive a lot of the content that we write, but obviously we can’t be across everything, so always keen.

Alessia Horwich (19:37):

Okay, so if they’ve identified something that’s trending, they think they’ve looked on the site and you’ve got a piece that’s been updated recently, so perhaps it’s prime for their new product, they’re ready to pitch it to you. What is the subject line of their email going to, I mean, actually you’ve said you are inbox zero, so you open everything regardless, but I mean, is there a subject line that you are going to see in your inbox and go, hold on, I’m going to make time to open that now.

Stacey Smith (19:59):

I think it’s really tricky because it is going to grab my attention if it’s something that I know I’m working on, which obviously is not helpful for a poor PR because they are not inside my head. But I do read everything and that’s the first place I search when it comes to writing a new piece. So I would just make it clear what it is, the brand name, so it’s searchable. So if it’s a rose and the brand name, why are you getting in touch? Is it a new product, is it an update? Is it new packaging? I’m not really interested in new packaging,

Alessia Horwich (20:30):

You’re not?

Stacey Smith (20:30):

no.

Alessia Horwich (20:31):

Is there anything else that there’s a hard no for you?

Stacey Smith (20:36):

Yeah, anything without an affiliate link and anything that’s just recipes. I don’t cover recipes. I get sent a lot of recipes.

Alessia Horwich (20:44):

You do?

Stacey Smith (20:45):
Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (20:45):

Even though as you’ve explained to me

Stacey Smith (20:47):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (20:48):

it’s a very clear delineation. Okay.

Stacey Smith (20:49):

Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (20:51):

What about the email itself? What info has to be in there if it’s going to work for you?

Stacey Smith (20:55):

Just a small blurb about what it is and why it’s interesting, why I should be covering it. A price and a link.

Alessia Horwich (21:02):

It’s very simple,

Stacey Smith (21:03):

Very simple

Alessia Horwich (21:04):

Imagery. Is that simple?

Stacey Smith (21:05):

You don’t even need to send it at that point. I mean if it’s really nice packaging, it is quite nice to include. But we just use a cutout shot and the CMS can normally pull that actually through for us. So depending, so yeah, we will need a cutout image, but it’s not like the first thing I need.

Alessia Horwich (21:20):

No, it’s not only a consideration when commissioning it?

Stacey Smith (21:23):

No

Alessia Horwich (21:23):

No. It’s more those little details, that point of difference, that kind of stuff.

Stacey Smith (21:26):

Exactly. Yeah.

Alessia Horwich (21:28):

How do you feel about embargoes and exclusives?

Stacey Smith (21:31):

So embargoes, I don’t really understand what, it just gives me another thing to have to think about. It’s like, oh, so you want me to write about it? But not until it suits you. I haven’t got time for that. What am I going to do? Put it in my diary to come back? No, it’s gone. I have no,

Alessia Horwich (21:45):

I’m not sure what food product would have an embargo.

Stacey Smith (21:46):

Lots does actually

Alessia Horwich (21:47):

Oh really?

Stacey Smith (21:48):

More wines and spirits and things like that. Or if it’s a collaboration with someone.

Alessia Horwich (21:52):

Yeah. How do you feel about collaborations with celebrities like them?

Stacey Smith (21:57):

I think they just need to be meaningful. They need to actually make sense for the product, not just because I think sometimes you can really tell when a brand has just slapped a name on something or when it’s a meaningful collaboration and they’ve been a part of it, but the Kylie wine range has done so well.

Alessia Horwich (22:13):

Is authenticity important for you?

Stacey Smith (22:16):

Yes. And I think on that sort of same line, sometimes I get sent things with a key hook and they’re just so silly, here’s this protein yoghurt for Mother’s day, and you just don’t, if it doesn’t work, don’t shoehorn it in. You don’t need to. Sometimes the key hooks are brilliant and that’s a real reason to update piece and it’s great to have those ideas. But yeah, don’t just shoehorn them in for no reason.

Alessia Horwich (22:43):

I wanted to ask you about the Christmas gift guide more specifically because it’s something obviously PRs always want to know about. What’s the etiquette around pitching for that? What’s a massive no and what’s really going to help you in terms of pitching Christmas gift kind of stuff?

Stacey Smith (23:00):

I would check who wrote the, because obviously there’s not one Christmas

Alessia Horwich (23:04):

No there’s so many of them

Stacey Smith (23:04):

gift guide. There’s hundreds of them. We have so many. So I would really check to see who wrote it last year, because chances are, if they’re still in the company, there’ll be the one looking after it this year. So I would do that to make sure you’re going after the right person. They tend to be a little bit later on, so you’ve got a bit more time with those things.

Alessia Horwich (23:25):

You sound weary of gift guides.

Stacey Smith (23:27):

Yeah. You’re just inundated. Yeah,

Alessia Horwich (23:30):

Yeah

Stacey Smith (23:30):

Really, really inundated.

Alessia Horwich (23:31):

But I mean that’s why it’s so important for PRs to be able to navigate it

Stacey Smith (23:34):

Yeah

Alessia Horwich (23:34):

properly and do it well.

Alessia Horwich (23:37):

And I think we’re always trying to ask journalists how can they pull it off?

Stacey Smith (23:40):

Yeah. The best thing would be to go to the right person. I think sometimes there is this sort of misconception that there’s a gift guide and there really isn’t a gift guides for every end user, recipient, price point, age, everything. So think about what you’re going after.

Alessia Horwich (23:58):

We’ve talked through a lot about how to pitch to Good house, well, food to Good Housekeeping Institute. Can you just condense for us, what are the main takeaways from our chat? If a PR was to come to you and say, what are three things I really need to know about pitching to you? What would they be?

Stacey Smith (24:12):

Clearly explain what the product is, why it’s interesting, why I should be covering it. A price, an affiliate link if possible. That’s it.

Alessia Horwich (24:19):

That’s it. It’s that simple?

Stacey Smith (24:21):

It’s that simple. If there’s a good key hook, include it. If not, don’t bother.

Alessia Horwich (24:24):

Okay. I mean, you’ve made it sound very, very easy.

Stacey Smith (24:27):

It is.

Alessia Horwich (24:27):

Is it?

Stacey Smith (24:28):

I don’t bite. And also it’s really, really nice meeting a PR face-to-face. Because I do remember when your email then comes through, I kind of think about them a bit more.

Alessia Horwich (24:38):

So how can they get you to come meet them, send you

Stacey Smith (24:41):

Well, through your lovely events and stuff like that.

Alessia Horwich (24:44):

Yeah Roxhill events number one.

Stacey Smith (24:45):

Yeah. No, they’re good though actually, because I do, had some really great chats at the pub thing that we did the other day.

Alessia Horwich (24:52):

pub club.

Stacey Smith (24:53):

Yeah. And you do just sort of, now I’ve got a few little coffee chats with people in the diary through that. And you just give people a bit more time naturally, don’t you, than you would otherwise when it’s just a faceless email.

Alessia Horwich (25:06):

Is there anything about you that you, particularly personally, that would really tempt you out with a PR? Like,

Stacey Smith (25:12):

Oh yeah, but it’s probably too cheeky to say,

Alessia Horwich (25:14):

Oh no, say it.

Stacey Smith (25:15):

So PR, some PRs now instead of asking for coffee or they just ask if they can take you for your nails.

Alessia Horwich (25:21):

Nails, yeah.

Stacey Smith (25:22):

I love it. I absolutely love it. I know,

Alessia Horwich (25:24):

I was going to say that

Stacey Smith (25:25):

it’s so cheeky.

Alessia Horwich (25:25):

several female journalists have said that to us.

Stacey Smith (25:27):

Have they? good.

Alessia Horwich (25:28):

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Stacey Smith (25:28):

It sounds awful, doesn’t it? But it’s so brilliant. So we do it.

Alessia Horwich (25:31):

It’s the same price as breakkfast right?

Stacey Smith (25:32):

It’s such a treat for us because it’s like lunchtime. You know exactly how long it’s going to last. Obviously lunch can be a bit hit and miss, can’t it? It can take hours or whatever. And you’re just really efficient and you’re sat next to each other. You’re focused on a task and you can just have a chat catch up. I love it. You’re going to end on that now, aren’t you?

Alessia Horwich (25:51):

We are going to end on that. That’s it.